
Today's Point/Counterpoint comes via local alt-rockers Soviet and Ft. Worth Star-Telegram entertainment writer Preston Jones via their Twitter accounts, in which the two parties debate the new Jay-Z/Kanye collab
Watch the Throne as well as the problem with mainstream rap.
@prestonjones: My review of the superb "Watch the Throne":
dfw.com/2011/08/08/491…
@SovietMusic: @prestonjones interesting review. I completely disagree. I feel that it's reviews like this that only further the idea that they are artists
@SovietMusic: I would suggest that the lens which you and many other ppl see these two is tainted by the "event" of their superstardoms
@prestonjones: @SovietMusic What were your thoughts upon listening?
@prestonjones: I'd argue that's part of it, but there's undeniable skill at work there. Each has an incredible facility w/words (cont.)
@prestonjones: (cont.) which sets them apart from most, save maybe Lil Wayne. I feel like rap's true essence is ability to convey (cont.)
@SovietMusic: I was completely repulsed by the mania of their ego and found it almost unlistenable. Mind you, i enjoy hip hop.
@prestonjones: (cont) the rapper's truth. In their case, they're superstars (like it or not), wrestling w/themes beyond usual subj. matter
@prestonjones: Interesting - I felt like some trax were commentaries, almost considering ego in a satiric way.
@SovietMusic: see, here is the fundamental problem. I refuse to acknowledge Lil Wayne as even a top 50 all time greatest.
@SovietMusic: so, if you judge kanye and jay z (who both are not top 10, not close) by Lil wayne, sure, it's good. But if u judge it by...
@prestonjones: What holds him back, in your opinion? I think he's pretty impressive, as modern rappers go.
@SovietMusic: ..MF Doom or Aesop Rock (just 2 examples), they sound like they have the vocabulary and intelligence of gangsta 5 year olds.
@prestonjones: They're not Dr. Octagon, no, but as mainstream rap goes, they're preferable to the likes of Rick Ross or 50 Cent (cont.)
@prestonjones: They're not Dr. Octagon, no, but as mainstream rap goes, they're preferable to the likes of Rick Ross or 50 Cent (cont.)
@SovietMusic: what holds Lil Wayne back is that he's a drug addled uneducated fame whore. And his generally misogyny and ignorance.
@prestonjones: You're gonna knock him for misogyny and fame whoring? C'mon, you've just discredited every rapper ever at one time or another.
@SovietMusic: but why should the qualifier of "as far as mainstream rap goes" matter? I guess its a larger question of whether or not art...
@SovietMusic: ...criticism a comparative discipline, trying to constantly place things in historical context, or a more normative discipline
@prestonjones: Because, fairly or not, there's a delineation there, in terms of awareness. J/K are *widely* known; MF Doom etc. much less so.
@SovietMusic: ...which is more trying to work toward a organic understanding of the work as an individual piece of art
@prestonjones: Definitely normative, at least for me. It's tricky, tho; w/this album, there's a need to also consider the hist. context.
@SovietMusic: re: Lil Wayne. Ok, so you are willing to ignore his entire body of pop work for a few clever verses here and there.
@prestonjones: I'll grant you his hit/miss ratio is worse than J/K's (for instance), but when he's on, he's fiercely impressive.
@SovietMusic: I'll agree it's tricky. We'll have to agree to disagree for now, twitter is not the forum for this, I'm sure you'd agree haha
@prestonjones: Agreed. And yes, Twitter doesn't really lend itself to discussions like this. :)
@SovietMusic: if anything, be heartened that your review sparked debate. "it's a good thing" - Martha Stewart, Convicted Felon.
@SovietMusic: come to a show sometime man, I'd love to debate in person.
@prestonjones: Indeed - I do appreciate the conversation (and thx for reading!)
=w=